Jesus this is the best visual novel I've played to date (and probably for long after), first entry into the horror side for me, and I may now have an addiction for the unknown. Man I loved Jenna's route. Sad its ended but lets hope we get to see the characters again in new releases!
I'm... wow. Flabbergasted by just how incredible this VN is. After playing though every route, I can say with certainty this is the best VN that I have ever played, and probably ever will. That said, heed that content warning; this is not for everyone. If you could be potentially triggered by sensitive subjects, themes, or images, you must put your own health first and keep yourself away from this. It goes to some incredibly dark places.
With that in mind, I'd like to, without spoiling anything, convince you to play this if you feel capable of doing so. Firstly, I must sing the praises of the writing, as of course that is the crux of any good visual novel: the writing is stellar. Very minimal grammar mistakes and typos, firstly, and beyond that surface-level, there is so much depth behind the writing. This is paced beautifully. Within I'd say 15 minutes, this story had its hooks in me. Its introduction has a way of feeding you just enough information to get your curiosity piqued, in probably the most natural way I've ever seen any VN do so. The narration feels very genuine, natural, like one's own inner monologue, and every new piece of info from the narrator is mentioned as if it's already understood, leaving you, the reader, with oodles of questions that spur you further into the narrative, seeking answers.
Then we have all of the characters... and wow. Every single one is extremely well-rounded and expertly written. You can feel and understand every one of them, their actions and behaviors consistent with their own personalities and the situations they're put in at every moment, and each one, including those that are minor and seemingly inconsequential, are deeper than they first seem. You will fall in love with at least the main cast if you play through all routes, which you will need to in order to fully understand the underlying story, which brings me to my next point.
You're always moving in circles. This is the thematic center of this game... and you as a player are forced to embody it, if you wish to get to the bottom of this story. You will have to return to the beginning, you will have to retrace your steps, you will have to move yourself and this world in circles if you want any chance at understanding it... and it is brilliant. I first properly picked this game up around 2 weeks ago... and I wasn't comfortable leaving it untouched for more than a couple days, because Echo has this insidious draw to it. And I adore that. Let this game suck you into it, and let yourself get captivated by the town of Echo. This game will leave a lasting impact on you, in my opinion for the better.
As a final note, my personal recommendation for the order of character routes is as follows: Carl, Leo, Flynn, TJ, Jenna. Carl's route is a more gentle descent into madness than the rest, and it should tell you whether you're interested in the rest of the routes, and then Jenna's ending is probably the best, most positive send-off you could hope for from this trying experience. But of course, your journey through the town of Echo is your own... and you'll come back. They always do.
The evil of Echo took advantage of his need to seek the truth, in the end he became Socket man and began to, sort of, travel through time. Every time you see Socket man, well.... That's Flynn....
Ok, let me recapitulate a bit (I may be a little bit off tracks 'cause I only went through it once.
He went to the mines, got burned, saw all echo, somehow got transported back when salamander boy saw him and he tried to rescue him, then got taken to the lake and that's when TJ saw him just before what happened to Sydney, then got transported waaaay back when Carl's ancestor pinned his crimes on his lover and his lover got hanged. Basically the evil was just transporting him here and there taking his conscience, Flynn sometimes remembering who he was, but mostly was not in a sort of auto-pilot. At least that is what I gathered. Don't know if that answers....a bit at least haha.
Someone told me that before playing TSR, it's good to play this VN first. Actually I don't know for sure what the reason is but I'll keep playing it...hehehe
So, do you guys have any suggestions, which character route should I play? Please?
I don't think I'll ever be forgetting how much this has affected me. Something about Leo's route, the entire thing really but especially the finale parts; it stuck with me. There's just a certain level of tragedy to it all that produces this uneasiness I can't seem to shake off, even a damn week later. Not sure whether I actually liked some decisions this went with or not, but I truly would not wish this dark depressing feeling this shit gives you on my worst enemy.
I suppose you're right. Even still though, I'm not sure the ending really gave the closure I was hoping for, if that makes sense. It felt like I was in the final act and then it just... ended. I guess it just felt really unfulfilling to me, especially with what happened with Leo.
Personally, even though Leo was acting all toxic, controlling everything and outright lying to you, I felt something for the wolf and yes, I felt horrible at the idea of Chase never talking to him ever again. But then again, it's something that must happen for a healing to begin
It's a matter of perspective. Like, I see the message it was trying to convey with having them separate, but I still felt discomforted by it. Sure, being apart will help them both, but is that really it? No other choices? That ending gave a sense of complete hopelessness that I just can't understand. It just leaves this awkward bitter taste in my mouth.
Route 65 is short prequel to Echo that gives a bit more background to what happened to the group. The route you choose in 65 is supposed to lead in to your choice of person to follow in Echo.
The events of Echo take place during Spring break of 2015 (So likely mid March). I mention this as some people's ages could be affected if they had an early birthday.
Chase is 21 years old, and in the events of Route 65 he is 15 during November 1st, 2008. It is likely Chase has a birthday between Late April and November and was born in 1993. (The wiki says he is 22, but that conflicts with him stating that he is 21 in a few scenes and some stuff Carl says)
Leo is 23 years old, and I believe that there was a scene where it was mentioned that he chose to celebrate Carl's birthday on Wednesday as Carl's is the closest, with Leo's already having passed and been a month prior. If this is correct, Leo was born in either January or February of 1991.
Jenna's age is not stated outright, but when the group was in school together, she was a year above Chase and year below Leo. She is likely 22 or 23 during the events of Echo. I can't make a guess as to what month she was born, but it likely is later in the year and not in March or April and was born in either 1992 or 1993.
TJ, baby of the group, is 19 years old. He is stated to be 2 years younger than Chase and is finishing up his first year of College when the game takes place. This is also brought up in Route 65, where TJ is only 13 years old. He was likely born in 1995, though he could be a 1996 baby instead.
Flynn is the oldest member of the gang and is 25 years old. This is reinforced with the events of Route 65 with Flynn already working with his Aunt and not being in High School, most likely having graduated in 2007. Depending on what month he was born, Flynn was born in either 1990 or 1989.
Carl is the only member who birthday is relatively set, being around late April (stated to be the end of next month, so this assumes the game takes place in mid March). Most likely Carl was born late April of 1993, however there are a few conflicting details. According to the wiki Carl is 21, however, there is a scene where Carl mentions that he cannot legally drink alcohol yet. This also conflicts with Carl being Chase's age, as being 20 would make Carl a year younger than Chase and likely put him in a grade lower. In Route 65, Carl mentions looking forward to driving, which would happen next year if he was 15 in 2008.
MINOR SPOILERS for the next Person
Sydney was shown to be either Chase and Carl's age, or a year younger than them, meaning he was likely born in 1993 or 1994, depending on when his birthday was. While I cannot give you an exact month for his birth, I can give an approximation for his death. In Route 65 it is mentioned by Chase that the group had to go back to school after Sydney's funeral. As they had been swimming in Lake Emma it is likely that Sydney drowned in Early to mid August of 2003. This would also match with the information that his father died 6 months prior on a hunting trip. When we are shown the hunting trip, it is described as a colder time of the year and Sydney and his father have to put on warmer coats. Mr. Bronson likely died in February of 2003.
I have only finished two of the routes so far and can say I'm loving the experience. I won't write a review just yet but I will Voice one gripe with Leos route. There seems to be only one character picture of Kudzu. Considering how emotional and crucial his role is, The default arms crossed stance clashes with many moments where the slightest inflection of an eyebrow or change of stance would express so much more. Could this be considered for future updates? Pretty please. He's really important to the feels.
it was said that all routes are canon and what i concluded from this is that The Evil From Echo(does it have a oficial name ?) seems to interact with all timelines simultaneiusl, MonsterFlynn(again does it have a name?) shows up in Leo and Jenna's route despite theoretically not existing in those timelines, also in Flynn's route while trying to leave Echo they encouter Duke's corpse and Chase car from Leo's route , this leads me to conclude that The Evil From Echo can move people and things between different timelines.
I came to this same conclusion as well. Even TJ recognizes Flynn as Plug face (having no other name...) What has me confused is Sam's attitude depending on the route. Sometimes he just helps and sometimes just lets Chase to rot, outright abandoning him and condemning him to the transform Flynn into...that. For this I believe that "the other" from Adastra series is the Evil of Echo. And sometimes Sam is overtaken by it and sometimes just helping the otter
have y'all seen the file "justafrienddaddy.png"? because like, i was going through the images, and i realized it's separate from the normal image of heather's room, and i can't remember the circumstances under which we see it?
I'm sorry your feelings are hurt, not sorry. What triggered you, truly? Think about it. Because, I merely responded to and referenced the "justafrienddaddy.png," and since it is an image file of we don't know what since ours truly didn't post it in their comments, I just thought it would be plain fun for everyone to see artwork of two Echo characters, one calling another daddy. No harm here whatsoever, so why are you so damn mad?
i mean, i'm not really all that mad, it seriously just seems like your goal is to upset. from what i recall, you've even put on opinions that contradict each other in the replies to different comments, depending on what that comment author would most likely get mad at. In this case, through our conversations on other comments of mine, it should be clear to you that Leo x Chase is my ship of choice, on account of Chase's reader insert-esque nature, therefore choosing to reply to my comment with a depiction of one of the two canonically supported contrasting Leo ships seems, to me at least, like a deliberate attempt to get under my skin.
I don't read minds. Idk what you like/dislike. I don't even know you. And neither can you towards everyone else, so I find it unreasonable/irrational for a guest to become hostile towards the host just because they abhor milk and grilled cheese despite the hospitable gesture. Htf would the host even know to begin with if the guest did not express their lactose intolerance beforehand...? I'm innocent within the confines of your original post.
Establish here which of the "opinions that contradict each other in the replies to different comments." I am now much more interested in your discourse.
Sure, you may call Leo obssessive and/or toxic, but does anyone stop as to ask: por qué? Unless we have concrete indication as to the nature of their failed relationship, I empathize with Leo because I know I can be as downtrodden as he when we allow our desires and fears to distort our feelings and perceptions of our relationships. Leo wants to settle, but Chase wants to explore. Leo plans a future with him, but Chase wants to have his own. They literally cannot be together because of their different goals. Leo essentially chases (I see what you did there EchoProject) him in an endless effort (a la tulpa) to fulfill his dreams, but the way I see Chase is that he is running away from his past (the "bad") and chasing his own dreams (the "good"). I recognize how much Leo loves Chase, and I know how devastating it is to have his love unrequited.
To me, Kudzu is a clean slate, no drama, no history with Chase, a new chapter, a fresh start. Who doesn't want to chase their ideal husbando who has little to no flaws especially when contrasted to another with polar opposite qualities? I'm no exception to implicit bias, but I choose to stand by with Leo because he represents our ugly side of humanity that is misunderstood and rejected. To heal is to understand and to accept the hurt. I see myself in Leo who is hurting, but I don't see anyone helping him heal which is ironic considering Jenna, an aspiring psychologist, fails to establish rapport with him especially with Chase around (a missed opportunity to practice relationship counseling).
Also, I am biased and based for anthrowolves especially one with a football dad bod~
Plus, I have a preference for Latinos especially those with dark skin, badboy looks, and dad bods~
woah, guys, no need to be so uptight (both of you). As a bystander I gotta say that WayrVvolf doesn't mean no harm, he just want to interact with community even though he does it his own... peculiar way.
tinybaroness, I know you may not find it appropriate. I would be a little bit upset as well if someone posted humorous comment in response to my serious one, but there is no need to jab, cause it's nothing wrong.
I presume you've been reading posts I made on other forums which makes sense for the sudden jab and unexpected outburst. You do realize posts are independent from each other, right? So don't go subjugating yourself and projecting onto others your negative biases that you have come to cultivate. Unfair to new posts and rude to passionate posters when you unwarrantedly spit venom at them thinking you're doing everyone a favor by exposing them especially in a forum that has had no drama as of late or at all.
Also, why should anyone apologize when they did literally nothing wrong to you, yet you react to them with an attack? Sounds like a you problem, something a specific creator must realize after dragging a whole community down with them...
Yeah I've seen the image too and I noticed that there is what seems to be a very creepy silhouette of Keith in the darkness at the far right of the picture. SpooooooKY. zoom in to see him more clearly. I wish it wasn't at night I saw this. He's just......standing there. With his jacket with an eye on it.
Chances are they will never be tampered because either i rarely use my table or no one ever goes to my room. This is like my first time buying merch from a favorite series or franchise too so i'll really make sure that it will never get touched😆. Also the day the whole gang gets a plushie set is the day ill use up all my savings
I just finished TJ route after flynn and the only thing I have to say is: Why? Why that happened, it's not fair, I actually cried and now I feel a void in my hearth because how tragic was that, and playing Flynn's route before just made it worse because this is all unfair and oh my God I don't know what to do now, I'll play Carl's route, somebody say it was happier.
You mean the destiny that Flynn had? Well he discarded everything and everyone in search for the truth. At the end he couldn't accept anything and that consumed him.
Good for you, happy for you! What's your optical diopter?
Everyone has an MBTI personality type, and everyone has MBTI types that naturally match with them in terms of relationships (i.e. platonic, romantic, etc.). I acknowledge you label Leo as an ESFJ, but I rely on the aggregate average (calculated consensus) which yields him as an ENFJ. With a quick Google search, you will discover that ENFJs naturally match with 2 MBTI personality types.
Apologies, a certain toxic forum on itch.io seems to be getting the better of me subconsciously. Without clear and concise communication, some things on the Internet (cuz its the Internet) sound like personal attacks. I could have deleted the rude comment with the strikethrough, but I chose to leave it there to show that I want own up to my mistake in misinterpretation; hence, my rational follow-up response right after it. Again, apologies.
I don't know of any guides that are completely spoiler free, but I will try my best to make one here.
The text on the actual choices has been altered to be as spoiler free as possible.
Of the five routes only Carl, Leo and Jenna have multiple endings.
Carl's branches with the choice of fight it/Let it in. Let it in leads to a Bad ending (This branch is fairly long and provides an alternate set of events from the good ending), while Fight it leads to another choice, Grab her/Push her. If you chose Grab her you get another bad ending (Albeit a fairly short one), while Push her leads to the good ending.
Leo's route branch's first at Help him/Grab gun. Choosing Help him leads to a bad ending (Ending relatively quickly after making this choice), while Grab gun leads to the next choice It's Over/Work it out. It's Over leads to the good ending, while Work it out leads to the bad ending (But I recommend checking both as it's rather short and really impactful).
There is a question in the Prolouge that determines if Jenna's Route will include a romance or not. Your options are Yes I'm gay (No Romance)/No I'm bi (Romance). Jenna's route branches with the options I don't know how to answer that/We kept each other sane/This town breaks people. The first two choices lead to the good ending, while This town breaks people leads to the bad ending. I should mention that all three choices affect some scenes later on, but there are only two endings that I know of.
If there are any other endings that I missed, I will try to add them.
Which is strange because the wiki mentions Chase as being homosexual, with no notion of bisexuality, and there is absolutely no way to form a romantic bond with Jenna unless I'm totally missing something here...?
From what I can tell there are a few issues where the wiki is either outdated or has slightly incorrect information. I assume that the wiki was written before Jenna's route was finished. In the final game when given the choice of saying I'm Gay or I'm Bi, Chase will elaborate that he prefers male partners and that his sexuality is complicated to him. In either choice Chase will mention to himself that he is actually Bi, and that he typically just says he is Gay to avoid having to explain it or confuse people.
Also the only way to initiate romance with Jenna is to say that you are Bi when given that choice, otherwise the romantic scenes are replaced with their friendship counterparts.
I used this order myself and enjoyed it. This is also the order everything came out in from my understanding.
You can tweak the order a bit, like doing Leo first or swapping around TJ and Flynn, but I suggest that you save TJ and Flynn for your 3rd and 4th playthroughs and do Jenna last.
Route 65 is a prequel to Echo with the same cast, but it should be played after you do Leo’s route for maximum emotional impact in my opinion.
After you finish Echo you should be good to go with Arches (Sequel) or The Smoke Room (Prequel). You should probably finish Echo first before going to either of these, but I was introduced to the series with Build 2 of Arches and don’t feel like too much was spoiled.
Here is the timeline you asked for as well:
Echo takes place during Spring Break of 2015 (Mid to late March).
Route 65 is a prequel to Echo with the same cast set on November 1st, 2008, when the cast is in High School.
Arches is a sequel with a new cast of characters that takes place after the events of Echo in 2020, at some point before Lockdown (Likely February or Early March).
The Smoke Room is a prequel with its own cast set in the town of Echo, but in 1915.
Technically you could play the game chronologically, however, it would be better to play starting with Echo in my opinion and sandwiching in Route 65 after you complete one or two routes in Echo.
(SPOILERS)I have a few questions which I still don't understand after reading through the story:
Who and what is this "spirit" that controls Chase (and eventually takes on Flynn too)?
In Leo's route, how did Flynn know Chase was in the mines(or to better state it, why was Flynn in the mines in the first place because it's highly unlikely Flynn knew where Chase was).
This might be a no-brainer question to some, but who was the true culprit involving Sydney's death?
Does the end of Flynn's route imply Flynn is the true monster and in this story?
What is the true cause of the mass hysteria in Echo? I feel as if something deeper is at play other than, "Chase's bad energy made everyone crazy".
What the hell even happened in Carl's route? It made so many references to the Smoke Room, which I don't even understand. The ending was sweet compared to the others imo.
I know most of these questions are probably still unexplained but these questions were seriously nagging my brain and I couldn't hold it any longer.
1. Chase is possessed by two ghosts: Sam (the actually good one) and the mirror ghost (from TJ route), the mirror one is probably responsible for Chase killing Sydney back in the day.
2. (I think) the reason Flynn is present in the mines is the same as in Flynn's route, he got there because of his histeria hallucinations that led to safe otter from death.
3. 99% Chase, however as I mentioned before I doubt Chase killed otter without exterior influence (the most probably the mirror ghost made him to do it)
4. There is a lot of ghosts in Echo, Flynn is the one that can travel through timeliness, the "socketface", the very same that Jenna, TJ etc. saw through their life
5. (I think) it is the main reason of the mass histeria beginning. Chase didn't want anyone to know what he did so fatal forces had to make histeria again to reveal truth. I do believe it is the reason, because in TJ route there is no histeria, the most likely reason is because TJ made a game that lead to reveal Chase's murder and histeria wasn't necessary. It wasn't otter's bad energy, it was his sin from the past that lead to this tragedy.
6. I don't understand? The whole plot was that the people trapped in "inception" had to reveal the Jack's? James'? rape on kids? whatever xd. This one that possessed Carl though
If someone see that I made a mistake or has other theory feel free to write it down, there is no plain answer for most of the questions :)
I recently finished all the routes in the game + Route 65 and agree with most of what you said. I haven't played The Smoke Room yet, but have seen Build 2 for Arches, so I may be missing something talked about in TSR.
1. Chase does appear to be possessed, however, I'm not sure that Sam is actually good. In Flynn's route he pushes Chase and Flynn to condemn each other and guides Flynn into the mines to become the Red Socket Monster. Maybe I misunderstand Sam's reasoning, but between that, his constant insults towards Chase, and how Mr. Bronson and Sydney reacted to being possessed by Sam, I'm led to believe that he is probably not a good spirit either.
2. I think you are right on this one. Flynn never really explains why he knew in Leo's route and its not explained in other routes. I assume it was either the Hysteria giving him that info (Similar to how he was led to the mines on his route) or that the Moore family knows more about the source of the Hysteria and Flynn's aunt tipped him off.
3. I 100% agree with you that it is likely that Chase was possessed when killing Sydney (if that is what happened). Chase is repeatedly described as being a good simmer for his friend group but bad by Otter standards. Sydney (also an Otter) is more athletic that Chase but somehow could not hold his own against Chase. While Chase did get a surprise attack on Sydney, the speed and power needed to hold down another person long enough to drown them is beyond a 10 year old in my opinion, especially when they should be able to hold their breath as long as you. I think Chase was given extra strength to kill Sydney by the Mirror Ghost (Likely a spirit that wants the Hysteria to occur) to kill Sydney. This would be similar to when Chase gains strength to beat up Flynn in TJ's route.
I do want to mention though it is strange to me that the only route that attempts to confirm Chase killed Sydney is TJ's. It is touched on with people accusing Chase in Leo, Flynn and Jenna's routes (And I assume Duke was accusing Chase in Carl's route, but it never fully came up), however, none of those routes fully confirm it. Chase when not possessed (by the Mirror Ghost) doesn't seem to really remember it, but in TJ's route he gets either fully or near fully possessed and seems to realize what happened. Only in TJ's route does he seem to admit to killing Sydney. I have some theories regarding the Timeline and how Route 65 works as a prequel but this is already a long post.
4. I think you got this dead right, so I have nothing to add.
5. So the Hysteria seems to be a cyclical aspect of Echo, caused either by the Quartz in the mines or just some cursed aspect of the land itself. The area absorbs the negative energy of the people who are in the area over time. Every so often the negative energy is released back onto the town's inhabitants and you get a Hysteria Event. The trigger of an event appears to be whenever a murder occurs and the killer gets away without being caught, but I think that is not quite on the money. For example Mr. Bronson and Janice killed Sam and hid the body, but there was no Hysteria in the 70s (The most recent event at that time was the 60s if I recall correctly), Sydney's accident with his father could also have been a trigger but nothing beyond the possession seems to have happened for either of them. There is also the issue with Brian killing 19 people and none of their deaths appear to act as a trigger for the Hysteria, but somehow Chase returning to town is the trigger. It's also mentioned that the Hysteria would have happened eventually even if Chase never returned, so Chase's return was just the tipping point. This leads me to believe that the true Trigger is Chase having relationship issues with the rest of the friend group.
Each friend has some reason they care deeply about Chase and want him to spend time with them, so when Chase focuses on someone else their issues seem to intensify. Examples include: Leo's Chase Tulpa, Carl's route being about a haunted house which was why Chase spent the entire summer in 5th grade with him as well as Carl having an imaginary Chase he spoke to when crashing his car, TJ always wants Chase to join him on a hike and Jenna mentions that TJ was most excited to see Chase, Flynn has a strong attraction to Chase but believes that it wouldn't work due to a variety of circumstances, and last but not least is Jenna mentioning she gets jealous of what she can't have and when Chase spends time with her she flaunts it in front of Leo. I think that due to everyone wanting Chase to spend time with them, stresses the group and also may be the reason why Chase appears to be the center of focus for the Hysteria. Throw in that Chase probably killed Sydney on top of that and you've got a huge storm coming, honey.
6. Carl's route is a bit off, but that may be due to it being written first. James and John are possessing their descendants (Carl and Jenna) in a fight to either hide what really happened or reveal the truth of who was the pedophilic serial killer (The worst combo). Chase gets wrapped up in this due to the town using him as the witness that has to figure out which spirit is telling the truth and which one lies, while Raven kinda got stuck by being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Carl's route feels the most disconnected with what is going on in Echo, but that is due to it really being focused on what happened around the time of The Smoke Room. Since it takes place around that time it makes sense for TSR to have a few references to Carl's route.
As stated before I just finished the game and haven't check out TSR so I could be missing somethings and this is all just my two cents. If there is something wrong or you have a different theory, I would love to hear it.
Thanks! I've been thinking over Echo a ton recently and have a few theories about some things within the plot.
The weirdest theory I have involves the various timelines and how Route 65 not only affects which route you are on in Echo, but might also affect what happened during the groups childhood.
I would love to see what other theories people have though cause it would be nice to see other perspectives on what happened in Echo.
I love your explanations on events so far. I'd be really curious to hear your thoughts on the route 65 changes to the group dynamic as I havent placed those pieces together yet myself.
The one thing I think I have a slightly differing opinion on is what happened at the end of Flynns route.
Spoilers!
I dont believe that Flynn is going through time. He is experiencing the events that happened in echo from the "almagamations" perspective as he's being assimilated in to it. I believe this is because he left everything (Carl and Dax who were representations of a good past friend and friends he could make) behind to learn the truth about what happened to Sydney. The spirit then takes the truth from him as he loses his eyesight.
The ending to carl route is so heart warming. It's make you feel like things are real but also not, gives me sometimes to think about my live, that's how deep it touched me. It such a rollercoaster of emotion, from the music of horror to the romantic music when chase and carl are together. I'm just really disappointed that they didn't get together after all that happens, if they did my heart wouldn't be so broken. The series is so good with everything linking to the smoke room i love it. I would like to have a future of echo tho more into the characters lives, mostly about Carl tho just bc he's such a bf material. I don't recommend reading if you can't takes emotional attacks from every route, you'll be scars but you'll learn some valuable lesson, except for leo he's just that crazy ex.
You can get more of Carl in Echo Interactive Short Stories: Benefits. I wouldn't call Carl "bf material" considering his "bad" habits - his frequent laziness and drug use that enables his laziness (and craziness in Jenna's route). I understand there are times to unwind and destress, but if someone lacks motivation, lives in constant fear (TJ), and/or make excuses to justify their ineptitude, regardless if they are wealthy and can provide, they are not relationship material for meESPECIALLY if they can't strike deep, meaningful dialogue. Carl is cute and can be hot but reasons above. Flynn is sexy but too toxic. Jenna is my intellectual soul mate, but she is female and I ain't hetero; therefore, besties. Leo, at least, is committed, understanding, passionate, idealogical, and determined (CUPID) who is willing to compromise and work towards the future together ad astra (bf material).
To dumb it wayyyyy down for you, I said Leo has the qualities that make him more bf material tome than Carl and/or Flynn. After all, Leo DOES have bf experience on his dating resume whereas the other two do not. I choose Leo>Carl>Flynn>TJ; Jenna, if I was straight/bi. READ carefully.
Don't worry I read what you said properly I was just dumbing it down as you say so as to not repeat your whole paragraph, if it really bother you that much you can replace the word toxic with flawed in my first post.
My point was that you singled out the flaws in Carl and Flynn while ignoring the very obvious ones in Leo which I found very funny, especially considering how prevalent they are in the story. But hey more power to you my dude, I just thought that was an interesting takeaway from the game.
Bout to play Jenna's route after Leo and TJ's. The story keeps pulling me in even though its almost paralyzing, like I have a heavy feeling in my chest similar to drowning. wish my sanity luck on my next route lol
I could not have been more impressed, absolute bravo to the team behind this. So far I've only made 1 play through. And it was the TJ route. (I honestly didn't even realize I had chosen his route when I made the decision but I came to grow really attached to the character). I cant remember a time I felt so emotionally invested in a story and its characters, absolutely amazing!
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How is it that each time I do a new route it makes me feel worse on the inside then the last one?
I'm going to have to find a new VN to cheer me up. If anyone has any good suggestions I'd love to hear them!(maybe something a little more upbeat?)
ps. I'm still crying...
how about... Tennis Ace?
I won't spoiler any from here, but i can promise its more upbeat than that (still have some sad scenes, but not as much as Echo)
and this vn is still in development so its not completed yet.
also i know that you asked for it a month ago, but i still wanted to help (somehow)
So, hope it helped!
Glory hounds
Jesus this is the best visual novel I've played to date (and probably for long after), first entry into the horror side for me, and I may now have an addiction for the unknown. Man I loved Jenna's route. Sad its ended but lets hope we get to see the characters again in new releases!
could someone explain to me the dead leaf meaning in Leo's route?
Me playing Echo was like: OMG!! I'm officially disturbed at all and I want to cry.
Me playing Adastra was like: My feelings have been destroyed and I am now burning inside. I am not hurt. I am destroyed!!
Echo Project, how is it that you know how to destroy us?
my download file says it's forbidden :(( aaa can anybody help me?
Mine says it too, what works for me is that I keep trying, eventually my device gives in. 😂😂
I'm... wow. Flabbergasted by just how incredible this VN is. After playing though every route, I can say with certainty this is the best VN that I have ever played, and probably ever will. That said, heed that content warning; this is not for everyone. If you could be potentially triggered by sensitive subjects, themes, or images, you must put your own health first and keep yourself away from this. It goes to some incredibly dark places.
With that in mind, I'd like to, without spoiling anything, convince you to play this if you feel capable of doing so. Firstly, I must sing the praises of the writing, as of course that is the crux of any good visual novel: the writing is stellar. Very minimal grammar mistakes and typos, firstly, and beyond that surface-level, there is so much depth behind the writing. This is paced beautifully. Within I'd say 15 minutes, this story had its hooks in me. Its introduction has a way of feeding you just enough information to get your curiosity piqued, in probably the most natural way I've ever seen any VN do so. The narration feels very genuine, natural, like one's own inner monologue, and every new piece of info from the narrator is mentioned as if it's already understood, leaving you, the reader, with oodles of questions that spur you further into the narrative, seeking answers.
Then we have all of the characters... and wow. Every single one is extremely well-rounded and expertly written. You can feel and understand every one of them, their actions and behaviors consistent with their own personalities and the situations they're put in at every moment, and each one, including those that are minor and seemingly inconsequential, are deeper than they first seem. You will fall in love with at least the main cast if you play through all routes, which you will need to in order to fully understand the underlying story, which brings me to my next point.
You're always moving in circles. This is the thematic center of this game... and you as a player are forced to embody it, if you wish to get to the bottom of this story. You will have to return to the beginning, you will have to retrace your steps, you will have to move yourself and this world in circles if you want any chance at understanding it... and it is brilliant. I first properly picked this game up around 2 weeks ago... and I wasn't comfortable leaving it untouched for more than a couple days, because Echo has this insidious draw to it. And I adore that. Let this game suck you into it, and let yourself get captivated by the town of Echo. This game will leave a lasting impact on you, in my opinion for the better.
As a final note, my personal recommendation for the order of character routes is as follows: Carl, Leo, Flynn, TJ, Jenna. Carl's route is a more gentle descent into madness than the rest, and it should tell you whether you're interested in the rest of the routes, and then Jenna's ending is probably the best, most positive send-off you could hope for from this trying experience. But of course, your journey through the town of Echo is your own... and you'll come back. They always do.
Could someone help me clarify what happened at the end of Flynn's route? I am so confused. 🤔🤔
Spoiler
The evil of Echo took advantage of his need to seek the truth, in the end he became Socket man and began to, sort of, travel through time. Every time you see Socket man, well.... That's Flynn....
Right, but what happened to him before that? He was at the Lake then...Confusion.🤔🤔
spoiler
Ok, let me recapitulate a bit (I may be a little bit off tracks 'cause I only went through it once.
He went to the mines, got burned, saw all echo, somehow got transported back when salamander boy saw him and he tried to rescue him, then got taken to the lake and that's when TJ saw him just before what happened to Sydney, then got transported waaaay back when Carl's ancestor pinned his crimes on his lover and his lover got hanged. Basically the evil was just transporting him here and there taking his conscience, Flynn sometimes remembering who he was, but mostly was not in a sort of auto-pilot. At least that is what I gathered. Don't know if that answers....a bit at least haha.
Do I want to read it? Yes.
Am I to scared to finish it? Absolutly yes.
Overall realy good writting from what I manage to read, but it's gonna take me few more months to finish since I need to brave up a bit.
Holy cow!
I did NOT expect to see that thing MOVE, IT SCARED THE LIFE OUT OF ME!
Someone told me that before playing TSR, it's good to play this VN first. Actually I don't know for sure what the reason is but I'll keep playing it...hehehe
So, do you guys have any suggestions, which character route should I play? Please?
I suggest to leave TJ and Flynn’s route at the end, otherwise you can play whatever.
Play Carl's route first, it's not that impactful, but keep in mind what Toasty said.
Okay, thanks guys. I'll keep that in mind.
I don't think I'll ever be forgetting how much this has affected me. Something about Leo's route, the entire thing really but especially the finale parts; it stuck with me. There's just a certain level of tragedy to it all that produces this uneasiness I can't seem to shake off, even a damn week later. Not sure whether I actually liked some decisions this went with or not, but I truly would not wish this dark depressing feeling this shit gives you on my worst enemy.
It's all about detachment, sometimes you just need to let go something that it's clearly hurting you.
I suppose you're right. Even still though, I'm not sure the ending really gave the closure I was hoping for, if that makes sense. It felt like I was in the final act and then it just... ended. I guess it just felt really unfulfilling to me, especially with what happened with Leo.
Personally, even though Leo was acting all toxic, controlling everything and outright lying to you, I felt something for the wolf and yes, I felt horrible at the idea of Chase never talking to him ever again. But then again, it's something that must happen for a healing to begin
It's a matter of perspective. Like, I see the message it was trying to convey with having them separate, but I still felt discomforted by it. Sure, being apart will help them both, but is that really it? No other choices? That ending gave a sense of complete hopelessness that I just can't understand. It just leaves this awkward bitter taste in my mouth.
There are ‘good’ endings depending on which route you are on. It really depends on what you define as good if the ending will be good or not.
I’m curious as to which ending broke your heart. I have a few guesses but I don’t want to ruin any of the routes for you.
Spoilers
Typically most people agree that one of the endings of Jenna’s route is good, though it’s not a perfect ending for everyone in story.
There may not be a "good" ending in a route, you must face this like it is. A journey through hell into madness.
He is a wolf and if the good ending got you like that, I don't know what will the bad ending do to you...
Baby Boy by Hot Freaks is so """good""" ending Leo
Just a fair warning, this game is way more fucked up than I thought it would be. The trigger warning should be taken seriously.
I'm guessing you reached Leo's Route bad ending...
Sooooo are they planning to develop part 2 of Echo?
Yeah, it's called Arches. The prequel is called The Smoke Room. Both aren't finished yet.
what about route 65 is it before or after Smoke Room
Route 65 is short prequel to Echo that gives a bit more background to what happened to the group. The route you choose in 65 is supposed to lead in to your choice of person to follow in Echo.
is there official ages or birthdays for the characters?
The events of Echo take place during Spring break of 2015 (So likely mid March). I mention this as some people's ages could be affected if they had an early birthday.
Chase is 21 years old, and in the events of Route 65 he is 15 during November 1st, 2008. It is likely Chase has a birthday between Late April and November and was born in 1993. (The wiki says he is 22, but that conflicts with him stating that he is 21 in a few scenes and some stuff Carl says)
Leo is 23 years old, and I believe that there was a scene where it was mentioned that he chose to celebrate Carl's birthday on Wednesday as Carl's is the closest, with Leo's already having passed and been a month prior. If this is correct, Leo was born in either January or February of 1991.
Jenna's age is not stated outright, but when the group was in school together, she was a year above Chase and year below Leo. She is likely 22 or 23 during the events of Echo. I can't make a guess as to what month she was born, but it likely is later in the year and not in March or April and was born in either 1992 or 1993.
TJ, baby of the group, is 19 years old. He is stated to be 2 years younger than Chase and is finishing up his first year of College when the game takes place. This is also brought up in Route 65, where TJ is only 13 years old. He was likely born in 1995, though he could be a 1996 baby instead.
Flynn is the oldest member of the gang and is 25 years old. This is reinforced with the events of Route 65 with Flynn already working with his Aunt and not being in High School, most likely having graduated in 2007. Depending on what month he was born, Flynn was born in either 1990 or 1989.
Carl is the only member who birthday is relatively set, being around late April (stated to be the end of next month, so this assumes the game takes place in mid March). Most likely Carl was born late April of 1993, however there are a few conflicting details. According to the wiki Carl is 21, however, there is a scene where Carl mentions that he cannot legally drink alcohol yet. This also conflicts with Carl being Chase's age, as being 20 would make Carl a year younger than Chase and likely put him in a grade lower. In Route 65, Carl mentions looking forward to driving, which would happen next year if he was 15 in 2008.
MINOR SPOILERS for the next Person
Sydney was shown to be either Chase and Carl's age, or a year younger than them, meaning he was likely born in 1993 or 1994, depending on when his birthday was. While I cannot give you an exact month for his birth, I can give an approximation for his death. In Route 65 it is mentioned by Chase that the group had to go back to school after Sydney's funeral. As they had been swimming in Lake Emma it is likely that Sydney drowned in Early to mid August of 2003. This would also match with the information that his father died 6 months prior on a hunting trip. When we are shown the hunting trip, it is described as a colder time of the year and Sydney and his father have to put on warmer coats. Mr. Bronson likely died in February of 2003.
If I have anything wrong, let me know and I'll fix this post! Also feel free to check the wiki, but beware of spoilers: Echo (Visual Novel) | Echo Project Wiki | Fandom
I have only finished two of the routes so far and can say I'm loving the experience. I won't write a review just yet but I will Voice one gripe with Leos route. There seems to be only one character picture of Kudzu. Considering how emotional and crucial his role is, The default arms crossed stance clashes with many moments where the slightest inflection of an eyebrow or change of stance would express so much more. Could this be considered for future updates? Pretty please. He's really important to the feels.
Replaced the mediafire download link with an itch.io one. Should fix your issue. - McSkinny
SPOILERS AHEAD
it was said that all routes are canon and what i concluded from this is that The Evil From Echo(does it have a oficial name ?) seems to interact with all timelines simultaneiusl, MonsterFlynn(again does it have a name?) shows up in Leo and Jenna's route despite theoretically not existing in those timelines, also in Flynn's route while trying to leave Echo they encouter Duke's corpse and Chase car from Leo's route , this leads me to conclude that The Evil From Echo can move people and things between different timelines.
Spoiler:
I came to this same conclusion as well. Even TJ recognizes Flynn as Plug face (having no other name...) What has me confused is Sam's attitude depending on the route. Sometimes he just helps and sometimes just lets Chase to rot, outright abandoning him and condemning him to the transform Flynn into...that. For this I believe that "the other" from Adastra series is the Evil of Echo. And sometimes Sam is overtaken by it and sometimes just helping the otter
That seems very likely to be true.
I call the monster socketface
Who the heck is Sam
You need to keep going on the story as the answer is a spoiler
Find out in the Echo prequel.
Pretty good.
I think so too.
The monster is called socketface or socketman by most people.
Lol, nice
Pffft that spoiler level is perfect. Also definitely suddering every time I forget about the game and see a socket.
spoilers!
have y'all seen the file "justafrienddaddy.png"? because like, i was going through the images, and i realized it's separate from the normal image of heather's room, and i can't remember the circumstances under which we see it?
Idk, but while we're on the topic of daddies~
sometimes i wonder if you have any goal in your comments but to upset people, you know that?
I'm sorry your feelings are hurt, not sorry. What triggered you, truly? Think about it. Because, I merely responded to and referenced the "justafrienddaddy.png," and since it is an image file of we don't know what since ours truly didn't post it in their comments, I just thought it would be plain fun for everyone to see artwork of two Echo characters, one calling another daddy. No harm here whatsoever, so why are you so damn mad?
i mean, i'm not really all that mad, it seriously just seems like your goal is to upset. from what i recall, you've even put on opinions that contradict each other in the replies to different comments, depending on what that comment author would most likely get mad at. In this case, through our conversations on other comments of mine, it should be clear to you that Leo x Chase is my ship of choice, on account of Chase's reader insert-esque nature, therefore choosing to reply to my comment with a depiction of one of the two canonically supported contrasting Leo ships seems, to me at least, like a deliberate attempt to get under my skin.
I don't read minds. Idk what you like/dislike. I don't even know you. And neither can you towards everyone else, so I find it unreasonable/irrational for a guest to become hostile towards the host just because they abhor milk and grilled cheese despite the hospitable gesture. Htf would the host even know to begin with if the guest did not express their lactose intolerance beforehand...? I'm innocent within the confines of your original post.
Establish here which of the "opinions that contradict each other in the replies to different comments." I am now much more interested in your discourse.
...anyway thanks for the image cause Kudzu is Echo's supreme Husbando.
Thank the artist first and foremost, they did bring the ship to life. I like Kudzu, tho Chase can have him, but I love Leo most.
Why is It that, being the toxic, obsesive controller that he is, has so much appeal? I love him as well, but Kudzu is the best (for me tho)
I cannot speak for everyone, but...
Sure, you may call Leo obssessive and/or toxic, but does anyone stop as to ask: por qué? Unless we have concrete indication as to the nature of their failed relationship, I empathize with Leo because I know I can be as downtrodden as he when we allow our desires and fears to distort our feelings and perceptions of our relationships. Leo wants to settle, but Chase wants to explore. Leo plans a future with him, but Chase wants to have his own. They literally cannot be together because of their different goals. Leo essentially chases (I see what you did there EchoProject) him in an endless effort (a la tulpa) to fulfill his dreams, but the way I see Chase is that he is running away from his past (the "bad") and chasing his own dreams (the "good"). I recognize how much Leo loves Chase, and I know how devastating it is to have his love unrequited.
To me, Kudzu is a clean slate, no drama, no history with Chase, a new chapter, a fresh start. Who doesn't want to chase their ideal husbando who has little to no flaws especially when contrasted to another with polar opposite qualities? I'm no exception to implicit bias, but I choose to stand by with Leo because he represents our ugly side of humanity that is misunderstood and rejected. To heal is to understand and to accept the hurt. I see myself in Leo who is hurting, but I don't see anyone helping him heal which is ironic considering Jenna, an aspiring psychologist, fails to establish rapport with him especially with Chase around (a missed opportunity to practice relationship counseling).
Also, I am biased and based for anthrowolves especially one with a football dad bod~
Plus, I have a preference for Latinos especially those with dark skin, badboy looks, and dad bods~
being dominated, possessed, controlled, and obsessed over is my love language
This is adorable!! 😍😍
woah, guys, no need to be so uptight (both of you). As a bystander I gotta say that WayrVvolf doesn't mean no harm, he just want to interact with community even though he does it his own... peculiar way.
tinybaroness, I know you may not find it appropriate. I would be a little bit upset as well if someone posted humorous comment in response to my serious one, but there is no need to jab, cause it's nothing wrong.
Jeez, I felt like parent scolding toddlers xD
You're right, sorry, this was just... a buildup of frustration with him coming to a head.
I presume you've been reading posts I made on other forums which makes sense for the sudden jab and unexpected outburst. You do realize posts are independent from each other, right? So don't go subjugating yourself and projecting onto others your negative biases that you have come to cultivate. Unfair to new posts and rude to passionate posters when you unwarrantedly spit venom at them thinking you're doing everyone a favor by exposing them especially in a forum that has had no drama as of late or at all.
Also, why should anyone apologize when they did literally nothing wrong to you, yet you react to them with an attack? Sounds like a you problem, something a specific creator must realize after dragging a whole community down with them...
Yeah I've seen the image too and I noticed that there is what seems to be a very creepy silhouette of Keith in the darkness at the far right of the picture. SpooooooKY. zoom in to see him more clearly. I wish it wasn't at night I saw this. He's just......standing there. With his jacket with an eye on it.
That Is NOT Just A Friend Heather!!!
Fuck! Just got MAJOR chills after you pointed out the dark figure...
OMG!!! Would have never realized it alone
Bought myself the acrylic stand set for my table since its very empty😆
Waiting hopelessly for a plush set. Careful you don't knock those over.
Chances are they will never be tampered because either i rarely use my table or no one ever goes to my room. This is like my first time buying merch from a favorite series or franchise too so i'll really make sure that it will never get touched😆. Also the day the whole gang gets a plushie set is the day ill use up all my savings
If they do move, but no one else touched them, you can only suspect [redacted]face was in your room, sp0.0ky...!
China better get their $h1t together, cuz I want to blow off my bank account on all 6 Echo plushies (8, 2 more from Arches).
I just finished Flynn's route and....wtf!? Can someone please explain? So I guess a Spoiler warning is at hand?
I just finished TJ route after flynn and the only thing I have to say is: Why? Why that happened, it's not fair, I actually cried and now I feel a void in my hearth because how tragic was that, and playing Flynn's route before just made it worse because this is all unfair and oh my God I don't know what to do now, I'll play Carl's route, somebody say it was happier.
Spoiler
You mean the destiny that Flynn had? Well he discarded everything and everyone in search for the truth. At the end he couldn't accept anything and that consumed him.
Does anyone have sheet music for the intro to Echo?
Replaced the mediafire download link with an itch.io one. Should fix your issue. - McSkinny
I know right? LOL 😆
When [redacted] Chase walks into the motel room.
does anyone know how the credits are done in the echo VN?
I especially liked the multiple pictures that were displayed one after the other after jenna's good end.
Please Someone, Which file(s) contains the codes/commands that control all the end credit screens?
I think the TJ route may have been the worst choice to do first
Holy fuck
No no, I think it was the best, I took Leo's route first and was completely lost with some things and ended up completely disturbed by the bad ending
I suppose it's better to understand more of the story, but still, this game wasn't lying when it gave the emotional instability warning
Brace yourself for Flynn's route, I think that's the most nerve wracking of them all
https://www.personality-database.com/subcategory/11668/echo-gaming-mbti-personal...
I don't understand the numbers people are spewing. Like, they're talking code, and I despise computer science...but despite all that...
I'm happy to say that...Leo and I are a natural match, yeeeee~!
what do you mean a natural match?
note: i typed Leo as a ESFJ
Good for you, happy for you! What's your optical diopter?Everyone has an MBTI personality type, and everyone has MBTI types that naturally match with them in terms of relationships (i.e. platonic, romantic, etc.). I acknowledge you label Leo as an ESFJ, but I rely on the aggregate average (calculated consensus) which yields him as an ENFJ. With a quick Google search, you will discover that ENFJs naturally match with 2 MBTI personality types.
number 1:if you disagre wth my typing of Leo i left my reasoning in a comment tread,you are welcome to enter the discussion
number 2: no need to be a jerk about it
Apologies, a certain toxic forum on itch.io seems to be getting the better of me subconsciously. Without clear and concise communication, some things on the Internet (cuz its the Internet) sound like personal attacks. I could have deleted the rude comment with the strikethrough, but I chose to leave it there to show that I want own up to my mistake in misinterpretation; hence, my rational follow-up response right after it. Again, apologies.
what why adastra rate higher than echo
This will be interesting, you think it shouldn't? (Just in case, this is just curiosity)
Theory: romantic fantasy > hopeless reality.
We are all running from hopeless reality.
Always, in circles.
Guess we should just stop then, just like the town...
Does anyone know a spoiler free guide to all endings?
I don't know of any guides that are completely spoiler free, but I will try my best to make one here.
The text on the actual choices has been altered to be as spoiler free as possible.
Of the five routes only Carl, Leo and Jenna have multiple endings.
Carl's branches with the choice of fight it/Let it in. Let it in leads to a Bad ending (This branch is fairly long and provides an alternate set of events from the good ending), while Fight it leads to another choice, Grab her/Push her. If you chose Grab her you get another bad ending (Albeit a fairly short one), while Push her leads to the good ending.
Leo's route branch's first at Help him/Grab gun. Choosing Help him leads to a bad ending (Ending relatively quickly after making this choice), while Grab gun leads to the next choice It's Over/Work it out. It's Over leads to the good ending, while Work it out leads to the bad ending (But I recommend checking both as it's rather short and really impactful).
There is a question in the Prolouge that determines if Jenna's Route will include a romance or not. Your options are Yes I'm gay (No Romance)/No I'm bi (Romance). Jenna's route branches with the options I don't know how to answer that/We kept each other sane/This town breaks people. The first two choices lead to the good ending, while This town breaks people leads to the bad ending. I should mention that all three choices affect some scenes later on, but there are only two endings that I know of.
If there are any other endings that I missed, I will try to add them.
the other important choice for Jenna's route is "yes I'm gay/ no I'm bi"
You are right, I forgot about that. I'll be sure to add that.
Which is strange because the wiki mentions Chase as being homosexual, with no notion of bisexuality, and there is absolutely no way to form a romantic bond with Jenna unless I'm totally missing something here...?
From what I can tell there are a few issues where the wiki is either outdated or has slightly incorrect information. I assume that the wiki was written before Jenna's route was finished. In the final game when given the choice of saying I'm Gay or I'm Bi, Chase will elaborate that he prefers male partners and that his sexuality is complicated to him. In either choice Chase will mention to himself that he is actually Bi, and that he typically just says he is Gay to avoid having to explain it or confuse people.
Also the only way to initiate romance with Jenna is to say that you are Bi when given that choice, otherwise the romantic scenes are replaced with their friendship counterparts.
Hey guys, I want to read this visual novel saga but I need your advice in regards of the order/timeline I have to follow to understand it fully.
I'm sure Arches is the last but in regards to ROUTE 65 and ECHO, which one should I read first?
Thank you in advance,
Snow
A common route order I see is the following:
Carl, Leo, Route 65, TJ, Flynn and end on Jenna.
I used this order myself and enjoyed it. This is also the order everything came out in from my understanding.
You can tweak the order a bit, like doing Leo first or swapping around TJ and Flynn, but I suggest that you save TJ and Flynn for your 3rd and 4th playthroughs and do Jenna last.
Route 65 is a prequel to Echo with the same cast, but it should be played after you do Leo’s route for maximum emotional impact in my opinion.
After you finish Echo you should be good to go with Arches (Sequel) or The Smoke Room (Prequel). You should probably finish Echo first before going to either of these, but I was introduced to the series with Build 2 of Arches and don’t feel like too much was spoiled.
Here is the timeline you asked for as well:
Echo takes place during Spring Break of 2015 (Mid to late March).
Route 65 is a prequel to Echo with the same cast set on November 1st, 2008, when the cast is in High School.
Arches is a sequel with a new cast of characters that takes place after the events of Echo in 2020, at some point before Lockdown (Likely February or Early March).
The Smoke Room is a prequel with its own cast set in the town of Echo, but in 1915.
Technically you could play the game chronologically, however, it would be better to play starting with Echo in my opinion and sandwiching in Route 65 after you complete one or two routes in Echo.
Hope you enjoy the read!
(SPOILERS)I have a few questions which I still don't understand after reading through the story:
Who and what is this "spirit" that controls Chase (and eventually takes on Flynn too)?
In Leo's route, how did Flynn know Chase was in the mines(or to better state it, why was Flynn in the mines in the first place because it's highly unlikely Flynn knew where Chase was).
This might be a no-brainer question to some, but who was the true culprit involving Sydney's death?
Does the end of Flynn's route imply Flynn is the true monster and in this story?
What is the true cause of the mass hysteria in Echo? I feel as if something deeper is at play other than, "Chase's bad energy made everyone crazy".
What the hell even happened in Carl's route? It made so many references to the Smoke Room, which I don't even understand. The ending was sweet compared to the others imo.
I know most of these questions are probably still unexplained but these questions were seriously nagging my brain and I couldn't hold it any longer.
Spoilers alert!
1. Chase is possessed by two ghosts: Sam (the actually good one) and the mirror ghost (from TJ route), the mirror one is probably responsible for Chase killing Sydney back in the day.
2. (I think) the reason Flynn is present in the mines is the same as in Flynn's route, he got there because of his histeria hallucinations that led to safe otter from death.
3. 99% Chase, however as I mentioned before I doubt Chase killed otter without exterior influence (the most probably the mirror ghost made him to do it)
4. There is a lot of ghosts in Echo, Flynn is the one that can travel through timeliness, the "socketface", the very same that Jenna, TJ etc. saw through their life
5. (I think) it is the main reason of the mass histeria beginning. Chase didn't want anyone to know what he did so fatal forces had to make histeria again to reveal truth. I do believe it is the reason, because in TJ route there is no histeria, the most likely reason is because TJ made a game that lead to reveal Chase's murder and histeria wasn't necessary. It wasn't otter's bad energy, it was his sin from the past that lead to this tragedy.
6. I don't understand? The whole plot was that the people trapped in "inception" had to reveal the Jack's? James'? rape on kids? whatever xd. This one that possessed Carl though
If someone see that I made a mistake or has other theory feel free to write it down, there is no plain answer for most of the questions :)
Spoilers alert!
I apologize for the long post in advance.
I recently finished all the routes in the game + Route 65 and agree with most of what you said. I haven't played The Smoke Room yet, but have seen Build 2 for Arches, so I may be missing something talked about in TSR.
1. Chase does appear to be possessed, however, I'm not sure that Sam is actually good. In Flynn's route he pushes Chase and Flynn to condemn each other and guides Flynn into the mines to become the Red Socket Monster. Maybe I misunderstand Sam's reasoning, but between that, his constant insults towards Chase, and how Mr. Bronson and Sydney reacted to being possessed by Sam, I'm led to believe that he is probably not a good spirit either.
2. I think you are right on this one. Flynn never really explains why he knew in Leo's route and its not explained in other routes. I assume it was either the Hysteria giving him that info (Similar to how he was led to the mines on his route) or that the Moore family knows more about the source of the Hysteria and Flynn's aunt tipped him off.
3. I 100% agree with you that it is likely that Chase was possessed when killing Sydney (if that is what happened). Chase is repeatedly described as being a good simmer for his friend group but bad by Otter standards. Sydney (also an Otter) is more athletic that Chase but somehow could not hold his own against Chase. While Chase did get a surprise attack on Sydney, the speed and power needed to hold down another person long enough to drown them is beyond a 10 year old in my opinion, especially when they should be able to hold their breath as long as you. I think Chase was given extra strength to kill Sydney by the Mirror Ghost (Likely a spirit that wants the Hysteria to occur) to kill Sydney. This would be similar to when Chase gains strength to beat up Flynn in TJ's route.
I do want to mention though it is strange to me that the only route that attempts to confirm Chase killed Sydney is TJ's. It is touched on with people accusing Chase in Leo, Flynn and Jenna's routes (And I assume Duke was accusing Chase in Carl's route, but it never fully came up), however, none of those routes fully confirm it. Chase when not possessed (by the Mirror Ghost) doesn't seem to really remember it, but in TJ's route he gets either fully or near fully possessed and seems to realize what happened. Only in TJ's route does he seem to admit to killing Sydney. I have some theories regarding the Timeline and how Route 65 works as a prequel but this is already a long post.
4. I think you got this dead right, so I have nothing to add.
5. So the Hysteria seems to be a cyclical aspect of Echo, caused either by the Quartz in the mines or just some cursed aspect of the land itself. The area absorbs the negative energy of the people who are in the area over time. Every so often the negative energy is released back onto the town's inhabitants and you get a Hysteria Event. The trigger of an event appears to be whenever a murder occurs and the killer gets away without being caught, but I think that is not quite on the money. For example Mr. Bronson and Janice killed Sam and hid the body, but there was no Hysteria in the 70s (The most recent event at that time was the 60s if I recall correctly), Sydney's accident with his father could also have been a trigger but nothing beyond the possession seems to have happened for either of them. There is also the issue with Brian killing 19 people and none of their deaths appear to act as a trigger for the Hysteria, but somehow Chase returning to town is the trigger. It's also mentioned that the Hysteria would have happened eventually even if Chase never returned, so Chase's return was just the tipping point. This leads me to believe that the true Trigger is Chase having relationship issues with the rest of the friend group.
Each friend has some reason they care deeply about Chase and want him to spend time with them, so when Chase focuses on someone else their issues seem to intensify. Examples include: Leo's Chase Tulpa, Carl's route being about a haunted house which was why Chase spent the entire summer in 5th grade with him as well as Carl having an imaginary Chase he spoke to when crashing his car, TJ always wants Chase to join him on a hike and Jenna mentions that TJ was most excited to see Chase, Flynn has a strong attraction to Chase but believes that it wouldn't work due to a variety of circumstances, and last but not least is Jenna mentioning she gets jealous of what she can't have and when Chase spends time with her she flaunts it in front of Leo. I think that due to everyone wanting Chase to spend time with them, stresses the group and also may be the reason why Chase appears to be the center of focus for the Hysteria. Throw in that Chase probably killed Sydney on top of that and you've got a huge storm coming, honey.
6. Carl's route is a bit off, but that may be due to it being written first. James and John are possessing their descendants (Carl and Jenna) in a fight to either hide what really happened or reveal the truth of who was the pedophilic serial killer (The worst combo). Chase gets wrapped up in this due to the town using him as the witness that has to figure out which spirit is telling the truth and which one lies, while Raven kinda got stuck by being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Carl's route feels the most disconnected with what is going on in Echo, but that is due to it really being focused on what happened around the time of The Smoke Room. Since it takes place around that time it makes sense for TSR to have a few references to Carl's route.
As stated before I just finished the game and haven't check out TSR so I could be missing somethings and this is all just my two cents. If there is something wrong or you have a different theory, I would love to hear it.
Thanks for reading my TED talk.
dude, you apologize for such a long and factual com? I love when people are REALY trying to explain something, the longer com the better :)
Thanks! I've been thinking over Echo a ton recently and have a few theories about some things within the plot.
The weirdest theory I have involves the various timelines and how Route 65 not only affects which route you are on in Echo, but might also affect what happened during the groups childhood.
I would love to see what other theories people have though cause it would be nice to see other perspectives on what happened in Echo.
I love your explanations on events so far. I'd be really curious to hear your thoughts on the route 65 changes to the group dynamic as I havent placed those pieces together yet myself.
The one thing I think I have a slightly differing opinion on is what happened at the end of Flynns route.
Spoilers!
I dont believe that Flynn is going through time. He is experiencing the events that happened in echo from the "almagamations" perspective as he's being assimilated in to it. I believe this is because he left everything (Carl and Dax who were representations of a good past friend and friends he could make) behind to learn the truth about what happened to Sydney. The spirit then takes the truth from him as he loses his eyesight.
does anyone know the name of the song that plays during the credits of leo's """good""" ending?
The name of the song is Blurry by Bug Boy. You can also find the music used in the game in the music menu after hearing it once in game.
Thank You~!
The ending to carl route is so heart warming. It's make you feel like things are real but also not, gives me sometimes to think about my live, that's how deep it touched me. It such a rollercoaster of emotion, from the music of horror to the romantic music when chase and carl are together. I'm just really disappointed that they didn't get together after all that happens, if they did my heart wouldn't be so broken. The series is so good with everything linking to the smoke room i love it. I would like to have a future of echo tho more into the characters lives, mostly about Carl tho just bc he's such a bf material. I don't recommend reading if you can't takes emotional attacks from every route, you'll be scars but you'll learn some valuable lesson, except for leo he's just that crazy ex.
You can get more of Carl in Echo Interactive Short Stories: Benefits. I wouldn't call Carl "bf material" considering his "bad" habits - his frequent laziness and drug use that enables his laziness (and craziness in Jenna's route). I understand there are times to unwind and destress, but if someone lacks motivation, lives in constant fear (TJ), and/or make excuses to justify their ineptitude, regardless if they are wealthy and can provide, they are not relationship material for me ESPECIALLY if they can't strike deep, meaningful dialogue. Carl is cute and can be hot but reasons above. Flynn is sexy but too toxic. Jenna is my intellectual soul mate, but she is female and I ain't hetero; therefore, besties. Leo, at least, is committed, understanding, passionate, idealogical, and determined (CUPID) who is willing to compromise and work towards the future together ad astra (bf material).
Did you seriously type out that Carl and Flynn are too toxic to be bf material but Leo isn't lmao
Nowhere did I say Leo isn't toxic.
Nowhere did I say Carl is toxic.
Somewhere did I say Flynn IS toxic.
To dumb it wayyyyy down for you, I said Leo has the qualities that make him more bf material to me than Carl and/or Flynn. After all, Leo DOES have bf experience on his dating resume whereas the other two do not. I choose Leo>Carl>Flynn>TJ; Jenna, if I was straight/bi. READ carefully.
Don't worry I read what you said properly I was just dumbing it down as you say so as to not repeat your whole paragraph, if it really bother you that much you can replace the word toxic with flawed in my first post.
My point was that you singled out the flaws in Carl and Flynn while ignoring the very obvious ones in Leo which I found very funny, especially considering how prevalent they are in the story. But hey more power to you my dude, I just thought that was an interesting takeaway from the game.
Leo has flaws?
Bout to play Jenna's route after Leo and TJ's. The story keeps pulling me in even though its almost paralyzing, like I have a heavy feeling in my chest similar to drowning. wish my sanity luck on my next route lol
Good Luck~
I hate TJ.
you're moving in circles
I could not have been more impressed, absolute bravo to the team behind this. So far I've only made 1 play through. And it was the TJ route. (I honestly didn't even realize I had chosen his route when I made the decision but I came to grow really attached to the character). I cant remember a time I felt so emotionally invested in a story and its characters, absolutely amazing!
bro im traumatized after tjs route
It's worse on other routes.
i know i finished everyones route except jenna and i say flynns is the most deadly
Deadly like the gila monster, venomous (not speciest).
Agreed. I felt so bad for flynn at the end of his route
Is Leo a Yandere? Discuss
Leo is a leo.
He becomes one the crazier he gets